With an unwavering commitment to excellence and a passion for providing comprehensive legal solutions, Glenn A. Stockton has been the driving force behind Stockton & Kandt, LLC, a distinguished estate planning and elder law firm situated in the heart of the Kansas City metro area.
Bringing a wealth of legal knowledge and a deep understanding of the complexities surrounding estate planning and elder law, Glenn A. Stockton has been at the helm of the firm since its inception at the turn of the century. Glenn serves on the Board of Governors for the American Academy of Estate Planning Attorneys and is a member of the National Association of Elder Law Attorneys (NAELA). He is an accredited attorney with the Veteran’s Administration and is a frequent public speaker and educator on estate planning and elder law topics.
Glenn is renowned for his client-centric approach, prioritizing clear communication and personalized strategies to meet the unique needs of each individual and family. His dedication to safeguarding the legacies of his clients and ensuring their peace of mind has earned him the trust and respect of the community.
As the Managing Attorney, Glenn has played a pivotal role in steering Stockton & Kandt, LLC towards innovation and client-focused solutions. His leadership has fostered an environment where legal knowledge is complemented by a genuine concern for the well-being of clients, making the firm a beacon of excellence in estate planning and elder law.
Beyond the confines of the office, Glenn is actively engaged in community initiatives, sharing his legal insights through public seminars and workshops to empower individuals with knowledge about the importance of effective estate planning. His commitment to making legal information accessible reflects his belief in the transformative power of education.
In addition to his role as Managing Attorney, Glenn serves on the Board of Governors for the American Academy of Estate Planning Attorneys, contributing to the advancement of the field at a national level. He also serves as the Chairman of Great Plains Senior Veterans, advocating for the rights and well-being of senior veterans, and holds the position of Vice Chair on the Olathe Health Charitable Foundation, furthering his commitment to community health initiatives.
Glenn earned his Bachelor of Arts degree from Benedictine College in Atchison, Kansas, and went on to achieve his Juris Doctorate from the University of Kansas. His educational foundation, combined with continuous professional development, ensures that he remains at the forefront of legal advancements in the ever-evolving landscape of estate planning and elder law.
In his role as Managing Attorney at Stockton & Kandt, LLC, Glenn A. Stockton epitomizes the intersection of legal acumen, client advocacy, and community leadership. With a legacy marked by integrity and a vision for the future, Glenn continues to be a guiding force in navigating the legal intricacies of estate planning for families throughout the Kansas City metro area.
Glenn is a fifth-generation Kansan, having grown up just outside Emporia in the family home that his great-great grandparents built. Glenn and his wife of more than 35 years, Tamela, met in Emporia and have three children, Derrick, Sophia and Alex, and eight grandchildren. Glenn and Tamela are family oriented, spending most evenings and weekends with their children. They love to travel, especially with the kids and grandkids. Glenn and Tamela also enjoy dancing and do so whenever they get the chance.
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-Transcript-
Brad Burrow (00:01):
Welcome to In a World With Real Media. I’m your host, Brad Burrow. In this podcast, we’ll dive into the lives of the most successful people in business. We’ll learn how they overcame adversity, took advantage of opportunities and learned from their experiences. Learn from our experts. Get inspired, then go live your story. It’s in a world with real media. Hello and welcome to the In A World With Real Media Podcast. I’m Brad Burrow. Today I have Glenn Stockton from Stockton Law and today, and I met them doing a video shoot down at KCPT and kind of learning about wills and trusts, and I was just fascinated by all of the nuances of all of that. So Glenn, I’m glad to have you in today. I am excited about getting into learning more about these things, but I also want to talk a little bit about you. I mean, I was reading your bio and how long have you had Stockton Law?
Glenn Stockton (01:06):
So we’re now Stockton and Can’t.
Brad Burrow (01:08):
Okay.
Glenn Stockton (01:08):
Started off as Stockton law 25 years ago
Brad Burrow (01:11):
As Stockton law.com, though. Right? Stockton law.com.
Glenn Stockton (01:13):
Right. We had the same website for a lot of years.
Brad Burrow (01:17):
Yeah, you don’t want to change your website, that’s for sure. So you grew up in rural Kansas around Emporia.
Glenn Stockton (01:23):
That’s correct. So moved there when I was 10 years old. My dad had been US Navy and had gone out to southern California with the Navy and met my mom there, and I lived there until I was 10. But when my great grandparents died, we moved back to what was left of the old homestead, family homestead. I grew up in the home. My dad had lived there for a period when he was young. My grandma was born there and raised there. So yeah, there was a lot of history in that. So I got to grow up on that just outside of Emporia.
Brad Burrow (01:57):
That had to be a little bit of a shock going from Southern California to Emporia. Right. Do you remember that?
Glenn Stockton (02:03):
I remember it very well. And even though I’d been to Kansas multiple times for family visits, I still had the idea that I was coming back and there was going to be cowboys and Indians and why I thought this, I don’t know, but that was a little disappointing. But no, I really enjoyed my time growing up on a farm and just in rural America.
Brad Burrow (02:22):
So were you around the beach in Southern California? I mean, was that kind of
Glenn Stockton (02:26):
We were not far. We were in the Los Angeles area, Riverside area, but we could, from our home, we could be in the mountains, we could go to the beach, we could go to the desert. We could really, that was pretty neat that we could be anywhere, but we weren’t on the beach. But certainly within 45 minutes or so of it,
Brad Burrow (02:47):
I don’t think we have any beaches in Kansas that I know of that are at least close to Emporia. There was always the beach at Melbourne Lake where we went as a kid.
Glenn Stockton (02:58):
None too close.
Brad Burrow (03:00):
One of the things I wanted to ask you, Glenn, is growing up in the Midwest, especially in a rural type of community, there’s a work ethic and a business approach that comes from that that’s different. Would you agree with that? Has that impacted you?
Glenn Stockton (03:16):
Absolutely. And I think part of it, growing up in rural America, we had livestock that had to care for, there was just things had to be done. And when I got off that school bus, there were chores that had to be done. I took my first job at 12 years of age and in addition to that, had a paper route. I’ve always said, I think I could audition for the commercials with Patrick Mahomes of never not working the old head and shoulder commercials.
Brad Burrow (03:48):
Yeah, yeah, right.
Glenn Stockton (03:50):
It just has been part of me from a very young age.
Brad Burrow (03:53):
I remember something you mentioned to me earlier was even you can remember at the age of five looking saying, well, how does this work? That curiosity kind of driving
Glenn Stockton (04:06):
Business. Yeah. I can remember going into restaurants and watching the flow of work and I’m just a young five, six years of age and thinking myself, that’s not how I would do it. So why my head was wired that way and paying attention to it, I’m not sure. But I would think about those things at a young age and so always been very entrepreneurial.
Brad Burrow (04:28):
Do you think that’s kind of driven a firm and working with other businesses, things like that? The ingenuity that comes with that?
Glenn Stockton (04:39):
Certainly. I think that factored into my wanting to run my own business. I grew up, I had an uncle who was a business owner and he was a mentor to me growing up, someone I really looked up to and he owned his own business. And so I think I had decided probably by age 12 that I was going to own my own business someday. But so all this, it just kind of all factors in plays together as we go through this journey of life and where you end up so much impacted by things that are happening to you in your childhood and growing up.
Brad Burrow (05:14):
So one of the things I wanted to talk to you about a little bit, I mean you’re involved in lots of different entrepreneurial type things now, but we will talk about that later. But I want to get into, so you went to Benedictine, right? I did. And what took you there? Because from, I mean you got several colleges around probably where you grew up, right? Emporia State, Wichita State, ku, how did you end up at Benedictine?
Glenn Stockton (05:40):
So I took a little non-traditional route, I suppose. I was planning to go to Emporia State. I had been working with my dad for the summer and was getting ready to go back to school and decided to go back to work where I had worked in high school. One of my jobs had been at a Pizza Hut in Emporia, Kansas, and my first night on the job, this pretty little blonde walked across my make table in front of it and it was over. So my wife and I started dating a very young age, got married, started a family, and so school got put on the back burner
(06:19):
For a bit and I decided, okay, I need to get back to school. And I’d always kind of knew, I don’t know how or where this came from, but the law had always interested me and I had this idea I wanted to go to law school and my wife was pursuing and wanted to be an educator. I started community college at Fort Scott and was looking at where I was going from there, and one of the administrators, he was dean of student Affairs, brought me in and said, I really want you to consider Benedictine. They have shown interest in you. And so they had me up and they offered me a scholarship, really called the Presidential Scholarship to go up there.
Brad Burrow (07:02):
Awesome.
Glenn Stockton (07:03):
Which that was helpful too, that they were going to pay all my costs. No kidding. But when I went up there, I immediately knew this is where I wanted to be. It was
Brad Burrow (07:17):
Really a beautiful campus it, I’ve been there several times for baseball tournaments and things like that, and it’s like you drive up the hill, it’s awesome.
Glenn Stockton (07:25):
Yeah, I used to sit and it’s changed a lot since the years I was there and that, but the campus, the setting has not. And I used to sit on the bench that they have now overlooking the Mighty MO as on the bend and we just find inspiration. I got there to do a lot of reading. So beautiful campus and it was a great school, liberal arts education that all that was what I was looking for. So a lot of credit that I give to Benedictine for my education.
Brad Burrow (07:53):
Now where did you go to law school?
Glenn Stockton (07:55):
So I left Benedictine. I went to the University of Edinburgh and Edinburgh, Scotland, and I did a program over there in really international studies. What I thought I was going to do was go to, so it’s a long answer, give
Brad Burrow (08:09):
No an
Glenn Stockton (08:10):
Attorney to give a long answer.
Brad Burrow (08:11):
That’s great.
Glenn Stockton (08:12):
I thought I wanted to pursue a career in international law. So I was over in Edinburgh and I was really studying monetary policy and one of the instructors, he was a co-editor of the Journal of Common Market Studies. And so I got to be inside in some of the high level meetings that were going on at the time as Europe was considering going to the single currency. This was in the days before the Euro and thought I was going to go into that and was really interested in monetary policy when I went to law school. That was at the University of Kansas. And we decided after being away from our families for that time in Scotland that we had children. By this point, as I said, it was a non-traditional student that it was important to have our kids back. So I went to the University of Kansas for law school. And
Brad Burrow (09:02):
What an experience though that had to be awesome being overseas like that. And I mean not too many people get to experience maybe some of the things that you were there for how long? A year or two? So just there for a year. A year.
Glenn Stockton (09:14):
One year.
Brad Burrow (09:15):
So did you do a lot of travel around there? That sounds really awesome.
Glenn Stockton (09:19):
Throughout Scotland. Absolutely. I was there on a student budget, so while I had scholarship that paid my tuition and books, living was not covered under that and having a wife and three children and she was not allowed to work. So travel was somewhat limited, but we saw a lot of Scotland and it was a magical time,
Brad Burrow (09:40):
Magical year. Oh man, that sounds amazing. So if I remember correctly, there’s a reason that you really kind of decided to focus in on wills and trusts and trust law. Can you tell that story? I heard this at KCPT, I believe, but this is a really an interesting story
Glenn Stockton (10:02):
Where I thought I was going, was going to go into international law and had been to doing everything through my undergraduate studies and that to prepare for that. Shortly before we went to Scotland, my grandmother and grandfather, they lived in Louisville, Kentucky. My mom had been an only child and my grandmother died and she was in better health than my grandfather. So we thought, but she didn’t wake up. One morning my mom tried to convince my grandfather to move back here to Kansas so she could help look after him. He really wasn’t able to live on his own, on his own needed help. He needed assistance,
(10:39):
But he did not want to leave his home. And so after my grandmother’s funeral, my mom stayed behind and helped arrange for home care to come in and help take care of my grandfather in his home. And then she came back to Kansas and six months later we got a call from my grandfather that he’d gotten remarried and I guess who he was remarried, it was the home care worker that was in the home. And then about three months after that, he himself died. So it was within a short time of my grandmother’s death that he’d already remarried and then died himself
(11:15):
And everything ended up going to that new spouse. So when we went to my grandfather’s funeral, same funeral home, my grandmother, we’d had her funeral at just shortly before the funeral director. He greeted us at the door when we got there. And we knew my mom had not been part of the funeral planning like she had helped my grandfather with my grandmother. The new spouse had done that and we understood that. We got there, the funeral director greeted us at the door and he remembered us. And I could just tell there was something, he was uncomfortable about something, he was a little nervous. And I picked up on that, just thought, what the heck’s going on? I having that thought process in my head, something’s up. I don’t know what it is yet. And then he hid us with it that he says, look, Mrs.
(12:00):
Reiner. So my new now grandmother, I guess Mrs. Reiner’s made clear, you guys are not welcome back in the family room. You’re going to need to sit out here in the chapel. And so we did at the end of the funeral, we had not left yet to make our way to the cemetery, the funeral, I’m sorry, my new grandmother, I go, guess the new wife came to me and said, look, you guys are not welcome at the home. However, if you’ll give me about an hour after we leave the cemetery, I do have some things I want your mom to have and I’m going to put ’em out on the end of the driveway. So after we left the cemetery, we went out to lunch with some extended family and then we made our way to my grandparents’ house. And sure enough, out on the end of the driveway was a box and it had a few knickknacks and picture frame and my grandmother’s bible, which is one of the two things we talked about, we would’ve wanted, it was clear my mom was not going to get anything of value, but we thought that Bible had been handed down through multiple generations.
(13:01):
It had genealogy records and that was something we really wanted to get. And the other thing was the photo albums. We thought, why would she want those? It’s not her family. And so this was my mom growing up, us grandkids, my grandparents when they were young, et cetera, and they weren’t there. And so I was the one who went up and knocked on the door. Pretty sure she was there because I’d seen at the funeral that she was driving my grandmother’s car and it was sitting right there in the driveway and the boxes on the end. So I went up and knocked on the door, but she wouldn’t answer. And this was the day before cell phones. So we drove to a payphone not far away, and I called. I called and I called. She finally answered and I said, Brenda, all, we want her the photo album.
(13:41):
And she hung up. We never got those. Well, I started law school not long after that thinking I was going into international law, but I took a class on wills and trust because I was really curious, how did that happen? How did she end up with everything? I didn’t fully understand it, but that course, what I found is my passion was not an international law. I thought it had been. I had been preparing for that. I really found my passion was in wills and trust. So it definitely influenced me and career choices. And as a young attorney, I don’t know if I had enough gray in my hair to do only estate planning, I’d have been twiddling my thumb some. So I did some other things in addition to estate planning. So when I started at the law firm, that was where my passion was really at. And then over the years, I was able to gravitate where, that’s all I do now.
Brad Burrow (14:39):
Do you think back if we’d only just done this or do you look at that maybe more of a positive type of view where that changed the path of my life potentially
Glenn Stockton (14:54):
With respect to what happened with my
Brad Burrow (14:56):
Grandparents? Yes,
Glenn Stockton (14:57):
Yes. Oh, absolutely. I credit that it changed the path of my life. I absent that, I don’t know that I would’ve, maybe I would’ve happened here anyhow. I’m not sure. But it certainly was my motivation. Why I took that class is to figure out how did she end up with everything. It didn’t seem right. I didn’t understand why that was, but
Brad Burrow (15:17):
You probably have empathy for people that are going through things like that now. I bet, huh?
Glenn Stockton (15:21):
That story, I see it played out over and over. And fortunately it’s us guys more there going in. But
(15:28):
As guys, we tend to remarry at a higher percentage rate, just so many more women in that season of life, I guess with women’s longer life expenses. But I see this remarriage scenario play out where all the assets end up going to spouses if people don’t plan properly. And it’s so easy to plan for and to make sure that doesn’t happen. But it does take some planning because by law, and this is what happened with my grandparents, it all became hers and then were various things that factored into it in my grandparents’ situation, but see it all the time. So it becomes something that we talk about with clients all the time. Is this important to you? Is this something you want to make sure that your assets go to who you want, when you want the way you want, and that a remarriage of a spouse isn’t going to throw a wrench in that. And so we can certainly plan for that. So it’s a common discussion we have.
Brad Burrow (16:21):
Yeah, wouldn’t it be important to everybody? I mean, I sit here listening to the stories who would not want to have everything taken care of, I guess, but we don’t are talking about us a little bit. As a business owner, you get so focused on doing what you need to do to keep the business going. You don’t think about things like that.
Glenn Stockton (16:44):
And that’s where I think having where you rely on professionals, that is what they do. They help you think about that. And I’m big, there’s no cookie cutter recipe that says, well, everybody just needs to do this. What are your goals? What is it you’re trying to accomplish? What’s important to you? What’s that legacy you’re trying to leave? And so that’s a big thing within our firm is to really understand that so that we can create an estate plan that’s customized to the client and what is important to them. And if I can understand that, then I can make that happen. And so we spend all the time making sure, in fact we have these conversations internally within the firm of making sure we dive deep into trying to really understand what it is that they’re trying to do. And I can over the years just see how our processes have changed, where I figured out, okay, we need to have another meeting where we can come in and kind of create this buffer. It’s not just come in, have a meeting and alright, your next meeting come in and sign documents we want to work through. And there are times that that’s all we need to do, but
(17:51):
For most people, we want to make sure that we’re designing the plan to cover the things that are truly important.
Brad Burrow (17:56):
So not one approach is the same for everybody is basically what you’re saying. Really got to ask questions and try to understand motivations and what do you want to happen then you make a plan. Yep. What are the assets that
Glenn Stockton (18:08):
You have? I mean, can make a difference. Are you a business owner or would be different than somebody who didn’t own a business? We got to plan for some different things there. Do you have children? Do we not have children? Those kind of things can factor in.
Brad Burrow (18:20):
Yeah, that’s awesome. Okay, so one of the things I wanted to ask, there’s probably a lot of misinformation about wills and trusts, what actually happens. Can you tell me what are some of the biggest misconceptions about wills and trusts that people believe?
Glenn Stockton (18:38):
Well, I think one is people often believe all they need is will. And they don’t really fully understand a will and what a will does. And that they think that trust, well, that’s for people that have a lot of money. And I think that’s unfortunate. It goes to somehow trust, I think gained traction. It was used as a tax planning tool for people that had higher net worths, but trust are fantastic estate planning vehicles. And so if the things that a trust can do are important to you, then I say, well, we should look to a trust. If the things that a trust does really aren’t important and we can just use a will surrounded by some other documents and beneficiary designations, we do that. So I always tell clients out of the gate, the first thing is don’t overcomplicate this stuff. Keep it simple, but be comprehensive. I don’t have a crystal ball. You don’t have one either. They don’t have one. So we have to plan for what ifs of life. So be comprehensive in the planning. But I think one of the misconceptions is trust are for people that have a lot of money
(19:45):
Or that all I need is a will. So I think that’s a common one. And I think another is people think of estate planning when they think of it. They’re thinking about what happens if I die? And for estate planning, it’s more than that. It’s like, well, what if you’re living but you can no longer make decisions for yourself? What if you’re living but you’re no longer able to live at home? You need to go into nursing care, assisted living. It can be expensive. How are we going to pay for that? How are we going to plan for that? Not every dollar is created equal. I mean, how do we minimize the impact to taxes? So estate planning is much more comprehensive than just where do my assets go when I die?
Brad Burrow (20:23):
Yeah. So my mind’s going in a lot of different directions here. What are three, give me three or five things that people need to know. I feel like education is something you probably have to educate every person that comes into the firm, right? I mean, I doubt too many people actually understand the level that they need to understand to really make decisions. Is that a correct thing?
Glenn Stockton (20:52):
Yeah, I mean I think it is. I’m big on education and at heart, maybe I’m more like my wife who was an educator. I convinced her to come join us in the firm years ago and give up. She was teaching school. But I think if people understand what’s possible and what they do, and I want ’em to understand the plan, why they have it. So
Brad Burrow (21:18):
I’m
Glenn Stockton (21:18):
Big on education. I get out and do educational events around the city and beyond multiple times a month. So I think it is important for people to understand how we can accomplish things so that they can make informed decisions to make sure that what they’re doing is best for them and their loved ones.
Brad Burrow (21:38):
How can somebody go out and learn about wills and trusts? Where would they do that?
Glenn Stockton (21:44):
Well, I mean there’s so much information that’s available in today’s world. We have information overload, but a lot of times you have to be careful with that. So we do educational workshops. So if somebody wanted to come in, if they would contact us, go to our website or reach out to us. We do no cost educational workshops on estate planning basics, trustee schools where we’re going to talk, what’s a will, what’s trust, what’s the difference? When are they appropriate? The living documents. What do you need to know about power’s attorneys? So I think that what level do you want? I tell some people that at one level there’s a three year program over at the University of Kansas that you could really dive deep in this stuff, but getting that education. So I think going to educational events about this and people are like, well, why would I want, I mean, that sounds horrible to learn about this, but it’s actually very interesting and it’s so relative that I find people really enjoy learning about this stuff because they can see how it directly impacts them and their families.
Brad Burrow (22:47):
So what are three things you think people need to know? If you could pick three things, what would they be?
Glenn Stockton (22:53):
One that you need to have an estate plan in place that we don’t always get second chances.
Brad Burrow (23:02):
And
Glenn Stockton (23:02):
This is something that’s easy to put off and think, I know I need to do it. I think we all understand we need to do it, but I can’t do it today. And so we put off and I just think we don’t get second chances. Two people will often think, well, all I need is a will. And they don’t understand that wills by their very nature have to go through probate. So typically when we’re looking at it, we look at a will as a sweater in the suitcase, we’ll revert to the will or lean on it if we need to, if we miss something. But we’re typically for most clients looking how to avoid probate. And certainly we can do that with trust, but we can do it with beneficiary designations, joint tenancy falls in. So I think they think all I need is a will, would be number two misconception. And the third one I think is that people think it’s complicated and it doesn’t need to be. And so that’s back to our philosophy is don’t overcomplicate this stuff. Keep it simple. Just make sure you’re being comprehensive.
Brad Burrow (24:02):
Three key mistakes people make, and we probably talked about this already a little bit, not doing anything has got to be one of ’em, right?
Glenn Stockton (24:08):
Right. So it’s back to thinking I can do it later. So not getting anything done at all is the states. You’re governed under state law, sometimes multiple states. And where do you own property? So I are sitting here in Kansas right now. So someone died in Kansas and owned property in Kansas. Well, they would be covered by Kansas law, but if they also had a lake home over in Missouri or they own some oil wells in Oklahoma,
Brad Burrow (24:35):
We
Glenn Stockton (24:35):
May have probate in three different states going on simultaneously. So that not doing it would be an absolute mistake,
(24:46):
Not coordinating their estate plan with the assets they have, the estate plan governing the assets, what happens to ’em. We either have to make sure that the assets, we got to make sure their title properly, beneficiary designations are set up. And so you have to do that. And so in our firm, I always tell people I look at estate plan as a team sport. If you’ve got a financial advisor you’re working with, they need to be part of this. We need to be coordinating because they can have something set up entirely different with how they’ve done beneficiaries and titling of accounts. Then what the estate plan says, well, for those assets, those titling and beneficiary designations are going to prevail over the estate plan itself. And I think the third thing is not reviewing this on a regular basis because we can get it all right coming out of the gate and we get everything lined up and it’s tied properly and beneficiaries everything’s in place.
(25:39):
But over time, as accounts change, we close that account up, we opened a different one, it gets out of alignment. And maybe even the choices you made in your estate plan, who’s going to be taking over at your capacity death? Who are your beneficiaries? All that stuff can change as life happens. So in our firm, we like to do what we call the annual check-in or annual review. We don’t charge for those meetings. We’ve always found that to be mutually beneficial. We’re not charging, but believe me, we benefit because our clients that they have future legal needs tend to look to us in our firm rather than the attorney on the street. But part of that annual check-in what we’re doing, first of all, we’re confirming plan choices. Here’s who you name to make financial decisions. Here’s who you name to make healthcare decisions. Here’s who you’ve named as beneficiaries.
(26:24):
Is this still the way you want it? I find is it can change and does change over time, but not that frequently. The second part of that meeting, in addition to asking How’s your health? How’s the health of everybody going in? We’re looking at the assets, okay, here’s where you had all your cash accounts, checking, savings, money, CDs, your retirement life insurance, that stuff. If nothing, more of the values are changing, which can affect how we do things because of taxation, but we find lots of change there, and that’s where you just want to keep that stuff up. And so we encourage our clients, as I tell clients, look, I’m not charged for this meeting. Take me up on it because this stuff’s important.
Brad Burrow (27:02):
Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. That’s awesome. So I want to switch gears. Small business, A lot of people will watch the podcast own businesses. How do you help small business owners protect their assets? Should I be taking notes
Glenn Stockton (27:17):
From that? Yeah, so when you have a business, the first thing, what’s the plan with this business if you become incapacitated? Because often as a business owner, you’re doing everything from, I say chief bottle washer, to you’re wearing a lot of different hats
(27:37):
And how does this business continue if you’re no longer able to do that, we’re always looking at a little bit of business continuity. Then we look at business structure. Are we set up as a sole proprietorship or are we as a corporation and LLC, how are we taxed? Are we taking advantage of that? Because those things will factor in as the attorney, how I’m going to put an estate plan together, potentially how I can incorporate that into the plan. Often for business owners, I’m always weighing, do we use a will-based plan? Do we use a trust-based plan? Two basic ways we’re going to put an estate plan together for business owners. Often we’re leaning towards that trust a bit because I tell people think of a trust as being a legal safe and I can put assets into the safe, including business assets. And so that upon incapacity or death, we’ve named people to make decisions on our behalf.
(28:32):
And so whether they’re doing so at the shareholder level or do we have a business plan or continuity plan that’s allowing for replacement officers. So all that’s got to be factored into it. And again, don’t overcomplicate it. Just make sure that we’re planning for those business assets because that is a very, when you leave a business at your death or in capacity and other people who are not familiar with this have to step in and take over and it’s all titled in your name and getting in, often that is the end of that business. The costs and complexity of doing so are so overwhelming that we lose so much value that goes in. So we just need to plan and a
Brad Burrow (29:13):
Nightmare for that person.
Glenn Stockton (29:15):
Right? Absolutely. Absolutely. So business owners, I’m like, we got to get this done. I might have a
Brad Burrow (29:22):
Prospect for you here,
Glenn Stockton (29:24):
Would be happy to talk to you about that.
Brad Burrow (29:26):
Well, and I think that just the idea of having everything in place and knowing what’s going to happen. One of the things I was also going to ask you too, is there a business structure that works better for a trust than others? Like C Corp versus LLC, whatever the different types of businesses out there?
Glenn Stockton (29:49):
Well, I don’t know that there’s one that works better. The rules are certainly different of how we go. I mean, an LLC, I suppose would be easier to transfer those interests into a trust or estate plan. Then with a corporation, we’ve got to recall the shares of stock and then reissue ’em in the name of the trust or something with an LLC. I can in essence, wave the magic wand and just assign those interest over. But no, I don’t know that that really makes it advantageous one way or the other. Certainly I think people have often not thought through fully how they’re taxed. And so for most businesses, we’ve got a lot of flexibility there. Do we take the S-corp election? Are we taxed? If we’ve got partners as a partnership, how are we doing the taxes? And so back to that team sport, I look at someone, especially a business owner, your CPA or tax advisor is a team player on that, and we just want to make sure we’re on the same page.
Brad Burrow (30:53):
Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. I want to switch gears to probate. I think that’s a kind of a scary word for most people. Can you talk about why is the probate system so challenging? What is it about it that we don’t want our stuff going to probate?
Glenn Stockton (31:14):
Well, probate by its very nature tends to be somewhat complex. It’s rule driven. And so for people who don’t deal in this every day, it can be overwhelming. They just don’t understand the rules. It’s going to involve the court. Now probate is not as bad as it once was. I mean now most states have some form of simplified administration, informal administration, but it’s still going to involve the court and the court’s going to, they’re coming into this like, Hey, we’ve got to divide this stuff up and we’re either dividing it and accordance with a will or under the laws of intestacy. So if you’re in probate, you’re in one or the other, right? Either you didn’t have a plan in place and so you’re under the state law is what we call laws of mentality or you had a will. And that’s what a lot of people don’t understand.
(32:03):
So here would be another misconception I didn’t cover that. Wills don’t have to go through probate. Wrong answer. Wills by their very nature must be probated. It’s just with a will. You decide it. When you create the will, you decide who gets what. Whereas if you didn’t do any planning, the state decides who gets what. It’s going onto the plant, but how do we get the assets? Your home, your banking house, how do we get it in the name of the kids or whoever we left it to? Well, that’s what probate court does. So if we boil down to what’s the essence or purpose of probate, it’s really to take assets that were titled in the name of somebody who’s dead and retile it to the name of somebody who’s alive. The will just tells the court who gets them. But the court in doing that, just got to make sure what does this stuff work?
(32:47):
How do we got to get appraisals done? We got to value things. We have to make sure everybody’s got notice and opportunity to appear in court and challenge things. And so because of that process and misunderstandings and the easy opportunity to come in, we see more arguing and fighting and probate than we might have had. We planned this all out better and made sure things transferred easily. And there weren’t court hearings and attorneys, because that’s the other thing, probate can get expensive. Trying to do it without an attorney is tough just because there are so many rules and that, so you end up spending a lot more money than you would’ve had. You just done some good planning upfront.
Brad Burrow (33:29):
Yeah, that’s why you should do it right there. So let’s switch gears again. Tell me about some of the other things that you’re involved in. I know you’ve got Cigar Shop, and give me the rundown.
Glenn Stockton (33:42):
So this is back to being that
Brad Burrow (33:44):
Entrepreneur.
Glenn Stockton (33:45):
Some son’s time has shine. So several years ago, back in 2020, during Covid, my oldest son, he was a high school science teacher, and he was that kid growing up that I was just saying, why do they do this this way? As I wanted business, he was the one looking up in the sky and looking at the planets and dinosaurs and just asking lots of questions that, so he had said, dad, let’s go down to Florida. I want to watch a nighttime rocket launch. And SpaceX had this rocket launch. So we went down to watch this and I said, Hey, while we’re down, let’s do a little fishing trip. I knew a guy that had a boat. Dude said, anytime we’re down, he’d take us out. So we had it all set up, and this was Halloween day of 2020. So October 31st, 2020 and High Winds moved in and they scuttled the rocket launch. My buddy called Boat and says, we’re not getting out of the water today on my boat. And
(34:40):
So my best friend who I’d grown up with in Emporia, Kansas, was with us on this trip. It was the three of us. So we went and sat in a little cigar shop in Orlando, Florida called the Admirals Club, and we were having a cigar and a whiskey, and my son looks at me and says, dad, we could do this. And so here we are. So we own the Ashton Anvil Cigar Shop down in Gardner, Kansas. My son runs it. My buddy’s also part of that as well as my other two kids. And then we opened up a speakeasy bar next door called The Forge. And this is all in a building. The building we’re in was the old blacksmith shop on the Santa Fe Trail.
Brad Burrow (35:19):
Is that right?
Glenn Stockton (35:20):
And so we took it back to the original brick and timbers and that kind of stuff. And so the cigar shop is the Ashton Anvil, right. Turning in with the anvil. In fact, we got an anvil sitting right in front of the humidor with a picture of the last blacksmith that operated in there.
Brad Burrow (35:37):
Is that
Glenn Stockton (35:37):
Right? In fact, we named one of our signature cocktails there, our old fashioned after. And John Hayden was his name. Family’s been in Gardner forever. So we opened the speakeasy, which is the Forge, and you come in a little blacksmith shop and it’s got a secret entrance. You got to pick up the phone and know the password, and the wall all of a sudden opens up and you’re back in this 1920s speakeasy. A lot of history in there. I mean, the back bar was built from a communion rail that came out of church in Ireland. It was made in the 16 hundreds. And that’s been part of that is our back bar now. And it is really neat piece. And then we have an outdoor bar with igloos and stuff for the winter months that is called the Bellow. So everything ties into that blacksmith and that when we excavated that back bar area, horseshoes and blacksmith tool, unfortunately a lot of the tools got the backhoes and stuff, bent those up a bit. But yeah, we dug up a lot of it. It was really cool process. So they’re
Brad Burrow (36:38):
Underground.
Glenn Stockton (36:39):
We had to remove a bunch of ground to get it to the level so you could walk out. We had to core out through the back to put doors in because there weren’t any. But it was a fun process. And all in
Brad Burrow (36:51):
Gardner then?
Glenn Stockton (36:52):
All in Gardner, all right there together? Yeah. And they’re separate. There’s no cigar smoking allowed. That’s a Kansas law for one, but they’re in the same vicinity.
Brad Burrow (37:04):
And how’s that going? Is it popular and doing well?
Glenn Stockton (37:07):
It’s doing very well. I wish to the law office, I could get so much interest and likes and everything that the community goes in. We have a very active online community of people going in, and it’s something people can get passionate about. So yeah, it is doing very, very well. And it’s kind of cool. I get to do business with my kids and my best friend and his wife. So we have a lot of fun doing this at the same time. I tell people, had I known what I was saying yes to, when my son says Dad, we can do that. There’s a lot of work that goes in, but we have fun doing it.
Brad Burrow (37:43):
Well, he’s probably enjoying it and learning a lot too. That’s pretty cool. Running a business. I’ve thought about having my kids involved. None of ’em are interested in video production or what we do here. So I was like, okay,
Glenn Stockton (37:54):
Well, I thought all three of my kids I envisioned, they would all join me in the law office. I think I grew up in the era of Dallas. I watched too many episodes,
Brad Burrow (38:04):
But
Glenn Stockton (38:05):
We’re Stockton a can’t. So my daughter Sophia Cant is a partner attorney in our firm. And so I get to be in her, but my two boys took other routes. So this was a way, now we’re all in business together.
Brad Burrow (38:17):
That’s fun. That’s awesome. So I want to wrap up here. Tell me what you see coming down the pike. I mean in law for trust and wills. Is there anything that you see changing or things that people need to be keeping their eyes open for?
Glenn Stockton (38:35):
Well, I think the one that we’re going is tax reform. Tax going in. So we’re in historical lows from income tax standpoint. If we look at where we’re at now in our income tax brackets compared to where we’ve been as a nation, our current law has a sunset provision. But I think as we look down, it’s hard to know what congresses could do. But I think with the election coming in, I think there’s a good chance because this law now was passed under the first Trump administration. And there’s been indications that his intent and I think is to maybe extend that. But we’ll have to see what Congress does. But we always want to keep taxes on our radar screen. How do we minimize the impact of taxes? And there’s so much opportunity there that people are missing. What I find, and this is not an indictment against CPAs or tax advisors, but their profession tends to be more centered on how can I minimize the impact of taxes for you this year and maybe looking forward into next year. But what they don’t typically do, they’re not looking, playing the long game down the board, how do I minimize the taxes over the next 20 years or for your kids when they inherit it? And there’s so much opportunity in tax planning that is part of estate planning and especially regarded to IRA. So I always tell clients I’m looking at things through my tax goggles.
(39:59):
I want help them to have a well thought out tax plan going in. So I think that’s one of the things we go in. Not a lot of the law is a machine that moves very slowly as far as that. So I don’t know that for most people that we’re going to expect to see any big changes that would affect wills or trust in and of themselves. But taxes are always changing. We want to make sure we’re taking advantage of the opportunities that are there.
Brad Burrow (40:27):
Do you have a team? I mean, you’ve got to be studying that daily or something. I mean, just to keep up with how much changes, even the nuances. Here we are, the governance about shut down, that’s going to make this a timely thing. But you got 1500 pages of things that are about to be passed that they hopefully are changing that. But man, you got to stay on top of things like that.
Glenn Stockton (40:53):
It is. So I just sent out an email to the attorneys in our firm the day before yesterday of changes, proposed rule changes the IRS and Treasury Department are making that would affect a certain tax planning strategy that often encompass trust. And this tends to be for the business owners and people have highly appreciated assets. And so being part of different national organizations that have people that that’s what they do, they’re attending committee meetings and watching legislations coming in and IRS. So making sure that plugged into that stuff is an important part of my profession because you got to stay on top of this to make sure that you’re not giving bad advice or c committing malpractice at the end of the day.
Brad Burrow (41:44):
You got to. How do you do that? I mean, is there an organization you’re involved with or is it just reading or going to, how do you stay on top of that?
Glenn Stockton (41:52):
All the above. So we are members of the American Academy of Estate Planning Attorneys. We have twice a year we’re in person with training. That’s a big part of that, the education piece where they have speakers come in and we’re learning as well as just things throughout each month. Nala, several, our attorneys attend the NALA organizations dealing with the elder law. So National Association of other law attorneys, big organization there, right here in Kansas City and Overland Park each year. And this is sponsored by the university Missouri kc, UNKC, law School, the Estate Planning and Symposium, which is a regional thing where they bring in national people really looking at taxes, change the law. So being plugged into those things, reading, you just got to stay on top of this. So I said, we’re in a society where there’s not a lack of information, but it’s just making sure we’re plugged into the right information and really staying on top of it. It can change quickly.
Brad Burrow (42:53):
I’m glad you guys are doing that. It’s funny, one of the things I talk about a lot when I’m talking to potential clients is that a lot of people, the younger generation that they just refuse to read, they won’t read anything anymore. And so we have to communicate visually with them, but can’t do that with what you’re doing.
Glenn Stockton (43:18):
Going go to those in person workshops, I guess. But I was a general, I grew up reading, I’ve always been a reader,
Brad Burrow (43:25):
And
Glenn Stockton (43:26):
So I’m doing that, but I find every rest videos are easy. So tuning to the things that you help do or business do is really
Brad Burrow (43:36):
Good for us. But yeah, reading, it’s just not something that I don’t think a lot of people do that much more anymore.
Glenn Stockton (43:43):
Not like they did before.
Brad Burrow (43:44):
Yeah. Well, I really appreciate you coming on the podcast. And if somebody wanted to get ahold of you, like we sparked an interest or something like that, how would you recommend they do that?
Glenn Stockton (43:57):
Well, I think going to our websites, probably the easiest, Stockton law.com, Stockton law.com, they can go in and learn there. They could certainly give us a call at our office. And again, with today’s world, that’s easy. Look up Stockton Law or Stockton and can’t. And you’re going to find us there. So reach out to us and even for people, because I’m sure you’ve got people listen that are beyond this. So we have attorney’s license, Kansas, Missouri, Arkansas, Illinois, and Colorado. Right?
Brad Burrow (44:32):
Oh wow.
Glenn Stockton (44:32):
So we can cover a lot, but if someone who’s in a state other than that, we can certainly help plug them in through those national organizations we belong to. We know a lot of attorneys. I sit on the board of Governors for the American Academy Estate Plan attorneys, so I can certainly get them plugged in with an attorney that this is what they do wherever they’re at,
Brad Burrow (44:57):
Everybody. Well, Glenn, I really appreciate it. I wanted to say to everybody that feel free to share this information. There’s a lot of information here. Share it with people, subscribe, go to the website, go to our website, check all of our content out. We really appreciate it. And we thank you for joining us and we’ll see you on the next podcast. Alright, thank you
Glenn Stockton (45:22):
For having me on. This has been fun. Enjoy it.
Brad Burrow (45:24):
Thank you. This has been in a World with Real media. Thanks for joining us. And be sure to subscribe on iTunes and follow real media on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn. So you never miss an episode.